Forums » Off-topic discussion » Russia to do to Engineering what India did to IT 1 2 3 4 5

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  March 14, 2011 9:39 p.m. Dr. Hess SuperDork

  http://www.news.com.au/technology/russia-taps-geek-power-for-growth/story-e6frfrnr...

  So, The O's great U.S. Economy recover plan, set up by The O's Vice President, Joe Foot-in-Mouth Biden, is to export our engineering jobs to Russia, thus wiping out the next rung up in the middle class. Just think, The O and the Russians can do to American Engineering (and Engineers) what India has done to American Information Technology and the workers that used to be in that field. Yup, that's a fantastic play. Think of all the cheap engineering work we'll get. Yeah. Fantastic. And the U.S. Engineering people? Well, we're a service economy now, so they can just flip burgers next to the IT workers. Note the article mentions "Russian parts and R&D services," thus putting the final nail in our manufacturing and product development industry. Meanwhile, talking out the other side of his mouth, The O wants more engineering students and more math and science in school. For what?
  

  Is this the change you voted for?

  This rant has been brought to you by Dr.Hess, the letters F and U and the number 13.

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  March 14, 2011 9:48 p.m. jrw1621 SuperDork

  2 sips

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  March 14, 2011 9:57 p.m. TRoglodyte Reader

  When you say Biden, I say drink, I win !

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  March 14, 2011 9:58 p.m. BoxheadTim SuperDork

  <raises glass> Nasdrovia!

  Sanity is vastly overrated.

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  March 14, 2011 9:59 p.m. Nitroracer SuperDork

  And it gets reported on an Aussie site so we don't find it as fast. Thanks Biden, my degree is almost finished!

  1968 Fairlane 500 / 1998 Camaro Z/28

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  March 14, 2011 10:11 p.m. HiTempguy Dork

  All of my alcohol is down in Red Deer, I'll remember to take eleventy billion shots of tequila for the good Dr.

  Rallying; It's like skydiving, except you have to dodge trees on your way down!

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  March 14, 2011 10:17 p.m. fasted58 New Reader

  the country that brought you Chernobyl

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  March 14, 2011 10:39 p.m. carguy123 SuperDork

  It just means everything will get heavier and clunkier. The space race had us going for finesse and the Russkies going for a bigger hammer.

  "mobilito ergo sum" I drive therefore I am!

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  March 14, 2011 10:46 p.m. Zomby woof Dork

  Great.

  Now I have to get another beer.

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  March 14, 2011 11:07 p.m. JoeyM SuperDork

  Can you start a thread and flounder it in the same post?

  914Driver: "Except for us {GRMers} who the hell would build a 1932 Japanese car?"

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  March 14, 2011 11:42 p.m. killerkane New Reader

  Maybe someone should point out that it is the head of Boeing that wants to move production to Russia, not Biden or "The O." Where in the article does Biden say he wants to export every engineering job to Russia eh? Nowhere.

  Biden saying that we should improve trade with Russia doesn't mean that we will export all of our engineering jobs there. The problem is not with our president, the problem is that the CEO's of large corporations want to make a few extra million by raising their shareholders profits by a few points, to accomplish this they need to lower production costs by exporting them to countries without a minimum wage, ie. China, Tiawan and now Russia to name a few.

  These words of reason have been brought to you by Mr. Loseke, the words Republicans and Love and BIG and Business.

  P.S. I am not much of a supporter of President Obama however, it is definitely not accurate to blame him for all of the countries problems.

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  March 14, 2011 11:46 p.m. JoeyM SuperDork

  You're new here. Let me give you a primer. Don't say anything that
  a) defends liberals
  b) criticizes conservatives
  c) criticizes libertarians
  

  If you do, you might cause some long time members' heads to explode. It's better to avoid the political threads.

  914Driver: "Except for us {GRMers} who the hell would build a 1932 Japanese car?"

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  March 14, 2011 11:47 p.m. oldsaw SuperDork

  JoeyM wrote: Can you start a thread and flounder it in the same post?

  Absolutely!

  Just like someone can campaign to raise the standard of living of the low and middle classes while making the country "competitive" in a gobal economy.

  Was your order for flounder "To Go", sir?

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  March 14, 2011 11:48 p.m. gamby SuperDork

  JoeyM wrote: You're new here. Let me give you a primer. Don't say anything that a) defends liberals b) criticizes conservatives c) criticizes libertarians If you do, you might cause some long time members' heads to explode. It's better to avoid the political threads.

  Next thing you know, he'll be pro-union, anti-gun, anti-pitbull and pro-environment.

  If He Gets Up, We'll All Get Up. It'll Be Anarchy!

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  March 14, 2011 11:55 p.m. killerkane New Reader

  gamby wrote:

  JoeyM wrote: You're new here. Let me give you a primer. Don't say anything that a) defends liberals b) criticizes conservatives c) criticizes libertarians If you do, you might cause some long time members' heads to explode. It's better to avoid the political threads.

  Next thing you know, he'll be pro-union, anti-gun, anti-pitbull and pro-environment.

  If He Gets Up, We'll All Get Up. It'll Be Anarchy!

  Haha! Yeah I already knew this stuff but thought I'd point it out anyway to start a flame war.

  In response to JoeyM: I don't like Unions, I am pro-gun, don't care about pitbulls as long as they're well trained, and pro-environment (but I still like fast cars and regard racing as advancing technology, not polluting).

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  March 15, 2011 12:28 a.m. Salanis SuperDork

  carguy123 wrote: It just means everything will get heavier and clunkier. The space race had us going for finesse and the Russkies going for a bigger hammer.

  ...but it will function for the most illiterate yokel in nearly any condition imaginable.

  I learned acro in a Russian/Chinese designed aircraft (Nanchang CJ-6, based on the Yak-18). Virtually all systems could function in sub-zero temperatures (pneumatic instead of hydraulic or electrical), and it could handle greater stresses than most pilots (the auxiliary wing spars alone were rated for about +4/-2G's; it could probably take +12G).

  Camaro vs. Lotus.

  Watching videos of sportscar racing does not fully convey the experience. It's more like playing a three-way game of Speed-Chess while strapped to a chair... inside a giant beehive.

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  March 15, 2011 12:38 a.m. HiTempguy Dork

  Salanis wrote: Camaro vs. Lotus.

  Ruuuuuhhhuuuusssssiiaaaaa, berkeley YEA.

  I like it, gotta ring to it

  Edit- Something ain't right when you you use a Lotus as a synonym for the USA.

  Rallying; It's like skydiving, except you have to dodge trees on your way down!

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  March 15, 2011 6:45 a.m. alfadriver SuperDork

  I suppse we should turn in the research dollars that DOE has given us to work with.

  Great spin, Hess- the best of Fox would be proud of you.

  Take fact 1- the current administration wants to expand trade with Russia.

  And take fact 2- Boeing thinks they can save money on engineering by outsourcing it.

  Put them together, and you have a fancy way to bash the administration.

  I wonder how you would have spun #2 had an R been in the house, since it probably would have happened anyway.

  Clearly, you like your fish.

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  March 15, 2011 6:56 a.m. Giant Purple Snorklewacker SuperDork

  We were undercutting ourselves long before the Indians and/or the Russians got involved.

  I left an engineering job in 1994 where I and 3 other people were responsible for the integration of 23 vendors assembling a glass plant production line. We worked 6 mos on the general plan, then out of a hotel for 11mos of 18hr days. It was some of the most rewarding work I've ever done... but I left because I could barely pay my mortgage on the salary. The competition was fierce and to get work you had to bid so low that you were under-staffed out of the box and any issue or deviation resulted in losses.

  Engineers could learn a thing or two from doctors & lawyers about price fixing.

  Lord of drivel and harbinger of Floundering

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  March 15, 2011 7:09 a.m. 914Driver SuperDork

  You don't need sonar to track a Russian sub, just stick a geiger counter out the window.

  BMW -- You don't need a hibachi to cook rice.

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  March 15, 2011 7:10 a.m. Dr. Hess SuperDork

  GPS, the physicians are screwed as bad as the engineers. The Feds bring in foreign doctors on H1B visas to undercut salaries.

  I did not miss that Boeing and other large US corps were pushing for this. I just didn't want to flounder this post () by pointing out the this is a perfect example of Corporate Socialism being pursued by the current administration. Oh, did I just call Young Mr. Kane's hero a Fascist?

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  March 15, 2011 7:33 a.m. Giant Purple Snorklewacker SuperDork

  Dr. Hess wrote: GPS, the physicians are screwed as bad as the engineers. The Feds bring in foreign doctors on H1B visas to undercut salaries.

  Yeah, you are right about the doctors. I guess, really, only lawyers get to make the laws and it is unlikely they would do so to their own detriment.

  I sometimes wonder if college is the right place for my kids to borrow themselves into oblivion - a skilled tradesman is a rare thing these days but the need for them isn't diminished in the least. The less people who can do things for themselves... the more opportunity there is for someone who can. It does not escape me that the guy who cuts my neighbor's grass drives a Benz or that the plumber sets his own hours and asks about $300 for each one.

  Lord of drivel and harbinger of Floundering

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  March 15, 2011 7:43 a.m. z31maniac SuperDork

  ^That's what I would do.

  I might make a decent living now, but who knows if I still will be able to in 2, 5 or 10 years? (Tech Writer)

  I wish I had become an electrician or something. I could go apprentice I'm sure, but I couldn't afford the pay cut.

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  March 15, 2011 8:04 a.m. alfadriver SuperDork

  Dr. Hess wrote: GPS, the physicians are screwed as bad as the engineers. The Feds bring in foreign doctors on H1B visas to undercut salaries. I did not miss that Boeing and other large US corps were pushing for this. I just didn't want to flounder this post () by pointing out the this is a perfect example of Corporate Socialism being pursued by the current administration. Oh, did I just call Young Mr. Kane's hero a Fascist?

  Dude, this is free market. they want the cheapest source of engineering- quality be damned. Large company wanting to cut costs. if that fits into your preception of the current administration, that's your twisting of facts.

  Far from socialism.

  Corporate socialism would be if boing allowed their engineers to form a union and collectively bargin for their benefits. Not farming stuff out to the cheapest bidder.

  Boeing will figure out their mistake fast enough. Well, maybe not fast enough, but they will figure it out.

  So the administration gets bashed if they work on workers/unions rights, but on the opposite side of the same coin, they also get bashed if companies farm out work based purely on cost, and ignoring current employees.
  

  I'm amazed you can do that in your head, hess.

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  March 15, 2011 8:15 a.m. Xceler8x SuperDork

  Read this book - Shop Class as Soulcraft: An Inquiry Into the Value of Work.

  Starred Review from Amazon said: Philosopher and motorcycle repair-shop owner Crawford extols the value of making and fixing things in this masterful paean to what he calls manual competence, the ability to work with one's hands. According to the author, our alienation from how our possessions are made and how they work takes many forms: the decline of shop class, the design of goods whose workings cannot be accessed by users (such as recent Mercedes models built without oil dipsticks) and the general disdain with which we regard the trades in our emerging information economy. Unlike today's knowledge worker, whose work is often so abstract that standards of excellence cannot exist in many fields (consider corporate executives awarded bonuses as their companies sink into bankruptcy), the person who works with his or her hands submits to standards inherent in the work itself: the lights either turn on or they don't, the toilet flushes or it doesn't, the motorcycle roars or sputters. With wit and humor, the author deftly mixes the details of his own experience as a tradesman and then proprietor of a motorcycle repair shop with more philosophical considerations.

  This book addresses subjects like out-sourcing and the ability to support yourself with jobs that society tends to devalue like plumbing and landscaping.

  Also, I think what Hess is trying to say is that we need to get back to taking care of our own. I think his villains are misplaced but that's a matter of opinion. To elaborate - I think his point is that the U.S. has sold jobs, materials, and knowledge over seas. Each sale makes us poorer as a nation. To regain, and/or retain, our status as a leading Nation we need to reinvest in ourselves. Whether that's O's fault or the CEO's lead by the nose via MBA's to sell our jobs to poorer countries in the pursuit of a nickle rise in stock prices. Please correct me if I'm misunderstanding you Hess.

  You are what you do, when it counts.

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