Forums » Grassroots Motorsports » What appliance, under $5K? 1 2

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  Oct. 1, 2011 5:37 p.m. ProDarwin Dork

  I want a new (to me) appliance. My current DD is a 94 SW2. Its fun to drive, averages 30mpg in my commute, is cheap as hell to fix and holds a lot of crap. That said, I'm always working on it. It has springs that are double the factory rate, an enormous rear swaybar, makes clunky noises, and in general is more of a toy than a DD. I want to get away from this, I have a different toy I'd rather play with. So on with the question: What DD? Requirements:

  Under $5K. Ideally under 4

  >25mpg combined, real world (I'm going to reference fuelly).

  Automatic (yes. I said it. It's an appliance)

  FWD (snow)

  Ultra-Reliable

  4 doors, decent cargo space (no coupes)

  Easy to fix/find parts for

  I did lots of CL reading this morning as well as some Fuelly research, and my options so far look like this:

  2000 ish Corolla - $2750-$3500

  99ish Camry $3500-$5000

  2002ish Sentra $3000-4000

  2002ish Elantra $2500-$3500

  I wouldn't mind a Civic, but they are expensive compared to the others. They are also hard to find in non-coupes and much harder to find automatics. Of the above it seems as though the Sentra is the best package of nice interior and decent mileage. I'm not too familiar with them though. I would LOVE to snag a hybrid - 1G Prius or Civic Hybrid, but I think I'll have to wait a year or two until they get cheaper. Finding one in this price range is a little hard unless its already around 200K miles. That said, it would be nice if whatever I bought didn't depreciate ultra-fast. I'm assuming the Camry would be the best in this regard.

  Anyway, thoughts? What cars am I missing?

  Also, how do I move down a line/return without putting a line in between. Posting a list on this forum is really hard.

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  Oct. 1, 2011 5:58 p.m. jrw1621 SuperDork

  In '01 and '02 the Corolla got variable timing and the mpg for those two years was 40 hyw.
  The often forgotten Chevy Prism is the same car, but if shopping an automatic be aware that the lowly models only got a 3 speed automatic. The way to tell if it is a 4 speed automatic is that the will be a second small button under the shift know which turns off/on the autodrive (4th gear)

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  Oct. 1, 2011 6:14 p.m. MadScientistMatt Dork

  One car you might be missing is the Ford Escort / Mazda Protege; they're often something many car shoppers forget to look for and so their prices are a lot lower.

  "Mad Scientist" Matt Cramer

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  Oct. 1, 2011 6:17 p.m. Ranger50 Dork

  Neon.

  "Never trust an intelligent man with no money to play fair."

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  Oct. 1, 2011 6:40 p.m. pres589 Dork

  Another Saturn? Also BJ chassis Proteges (1998 to 2003) seem pretty easy to find in this range as well as the previously mentioned BG cars.

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  Oct. 1, 2011 7:26 p.m. Sky_Render New Reader

  Neon or Cavalier?

  I race a 2011 Mustang 5.0 around CORNERS!

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  Oct. 1, 2011 7:51 p.m. bigdaddylee82 New Reader

  850 Wagon (855) and/or V70

  850 Sedan (854) and/or S70

  They tick all your check boxes. Expect to find a lot of parts online, so ~3 days to ship something to ya vs. going to Vatozone and picking up a Chebby part.

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  Oct. 1, 2011 8:16 p.m. ProDarwin Dork

  jrw1621 wrote: In '01 and '02 the Corolla got variable timing and the mpg for those two years was 40 hyw.

  Noted. And thanks for the reminder about the 3-spd auto. I recall my dad having one as a rental back in the day, but wasn't thinking about it at all.

  MadScientistMatt wrote: One car you might be missing is the Ford Escort / Mazda Protege; they're often something many car shoppers forget to look for and so their prices are a lot lower.

  Also noted. I did search for the Protege, but didn't see much out there, and what I found was manual. I'm not totally opposed to a manual, but I really want to avoid getting something I'll want to modify. Also, IIRC isn't there an issue with Protege's spinning rod bearings?

  Escort is now on the list. Decent, boring car. Available pretty cheap too. Awful interior (and that's coming from a Saturn owner!)

  Ranger50 wrote: Neon.

  Never been a fan of these, but I suppose they are worth looking into. Seems you can get into an 04 for like $3500. Very cheap. Is there are reason for this?

  pres589 wrote: Another Saturn? Also BJ chassis Proteges (1998 to 2003) seem pretty easy to find in this range as well as the previously mentioned BG cars.

  There is potential for another Saturn. I've had lots of luck with them in the past (this one is #7), but I'm kinda itching for something different. That said, I do know them like the back of my hand, so I'm not afraid to work on one. The last auto beater I had I profited almost $2000 on after putting 40K miles on it. I suppose I could consider a newer model that will likely require much less maintenance/spent less time being neglected.

  bigdaddylee82 wrote: 850 Wagon (855) and/or V70 850 Sedan (854) and/or S70 They tick all your check boxes. Expect to find a lot of parts online, so ~3 days to ship something to ya vs. going to Vatozone and picking up a Chebby part.

  Tempting. I do like the V/S 70s. They are much more rare in this price range than the above cars. Their mileage isn't great at all though, and they require premium fuel, further magnifying the fuel cost.

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  Oct. 1, 2011 8:31 p.m. bigdaddylee82 New Reader

  In reply to ProDarwin:

  Well, for an "appliance" I was thinking non-turbo, so no need for premium. True, mileage isn't as great as some others, my 850 N/A Auto, gets high 20s. Put a timing belt on ever 80K miles or so, and a water pump about every other timing belt, and the Whiteblock will last just about forever.

  • Lee
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  Oct. 1, 2011 8:40 p.m. jrw1621 SuperDork

  I liked the '95 Volvo 850 wagon 5 speed manual, non turbo that I owned from 106k miles to 165k miles over 3 years. I typically got 24 mpg in combined driving with no effort put into getting good mpg.
  A wonderful amount of space and utility. Mine was regular gas.

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  Oct. 1, 2011 8:51 p.m. ProDarwin Dork

  Hmm. Fuel economy.gov said that both engines required premium. 24mpg isn't really going to cut it. I set the 25mpg minimum, but really I'd like to stay above that number if at all possible.

  I currently drive a wagon. Wagons berkeleying rule. That said, I rarely get the chance to utilize the greater-than-a-sedan cargo capacity. It's happened, and it was awesome, but as often as it does, I'm not sure its worth going out of my way to find another wagon.

  I'm not discounting it. If I come across a good one I'll certainly investigate it.

  The timing belt comment makes me wonder... how many of the cars I've mentioned have belts vs. chains? Not a deal-breaker by any means, but I'm not a fan of belts.

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  Oct. 1, 2011 9:25 p.m. jrw1621 SuperDork

  Ford Escort or Focus Wagon?
  If you want a bit more exotic then maybe a Saab 9-5 Wagon but the mpg will be like the Volvos

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  Oct. 1, 2011 9:55 p.m. Sonic Dork

  The ultimate cheap appliance cars are the Toyotas with GM badges. The Geo/Chevy Prizm was a Corolla with a Chebby logo. The Pontiac Vibe is a Toyota Matrix from a now dead brand. They frequently trade for far less than their equal Toyota equivalents. Both get good mileage, will run forever, and be a perfect refrigerator.

  Chris - 2007 BABE champion, 2008 2nd place. Miata, MGA, DiscoII 2010 - Trifecta of Crap in the Wartburg. $2002, $2006 $2010 challenger

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  Oct. 1, 2011 10:16 p.m. mmosbey Reader

  Suzuki Aerio SX Wagon? A friend of mine had one and liked it. I can second the Protege and Corolla.

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  Oct. 1, 2011 10:22 p.m. ProDarwin Dork

  mmosbey wrote: Suzuki Aerio SX Wagon? A friend of mine had one and liked it. I can second the Protege and Corolla.

  None locally in that price range. Also, a friend of mine has one and the high roof/seat height makes the driving position feel really weird to me. Almost nauseating.

  That said, what about the Forenza or Esteem? Some clean examples of these locally.

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  Oct. 2, 2011 12:41 a.m. Travis_K SuperDork

  You could geta beater TDI jetta or passat for $4500 and use the money you save from the extra 20 mpg to catch up on the maintenance, VW automatics are an epic fail though so you would want to stay with the 5 speed. I imagine a neon would be pretty similar to a saturn, i have ridden in a couple of saturns and driven a neon quite a bit and they arent really a lot different.

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  Oct. 2, 2011 7:25 a.m. 02Pilot Reader

  ProDarwin wrote: That said, what about the Forenza or Esteem? Some clean examples of these locally.

  I had a Forenza for a couple days as a rental. It was brand new (>1k miles) and felt like the cheapest, flimsiest hunk of tin foil I've ever driven. The trunk lid visibly flexed when opened or closed. I was half expecting to see ripples in the bodywork after driving it at highway speeds. Gutless, cheap, and awful.

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  Oct. 2, 2011 9:37 a.m. pres589 Dork

  I can't imagine anyone passing up the Protege option for an Esteem unless they had recently experienced blunt force trauma to the head.

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  Oct. 2, 2011 11:31 a.m. ST_ZX2 Reader

  2001+ Focus SE/ZTS Sedan (with Zetec).

  Erik B. _/\__/\__/\__/\__/\_

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  Oct. 2, 2011 7:51 p.m. Vigo Dork

  Some of these options arent really a step up from the 94 saturn in anything but price...

  I agree with your Sentra idea, plus im pretty sure you could get the 2.5 with auto in some non se-r sentras.

  I like the 02-05 corollas reasonably well, but they have no torque whatsoever. My memory on the 95-01 is too vague to pass judgment.

  I really like the vibe/matrix idea. ALSO torqueless but still decent vehicles that will be highly functional and not tempt you to modify them.

  3.0/auto camrys are just fine to drive imo.

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  Oct. 2, 2011 8:17 p.m. MCarp22 HalfDork

  ProDarwin wrote: 2002ish Sentra $3000-4000

  Vigo wrote: I agree with your Sentra idea, plus im pretty sure you could get the 2.5 with auto in some non se-r sentras.

  Look instead to the 2000-2001 Sentra SE. Last nissan in the US to get the SR20DE. Won't eat it's own catalytic converter like the 2.5.

  Mike Carpeter - 1991 Sentra SE-R

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  Oct. 2, 2011 8:19 p.m. EvanR Reader

  jrw1621 wrote: In '01 and '02 the Corolla got variable timing and the mpg for those two years was 40 hyw. The often forgotten Chevy Prism is the same car, but if shopping an automatic be aware that the lowly models only got a 3 speed automatic. The way to tell if it is a 4 speed automatic is that the will be a second small button under the shift know which turns off/on the autodrive (4th gear)

  +1 for this. The latest model Chevrolet Prizm you can find. I't my #1 appliance recommendation, and has been for years.

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  Oct. 2, 2011 8:45 p.m. ProDarwin Dork

  Vigo wrote: Some of these options arent really a step up from the 94 saturn in anything but price... I agree with your Sentra idea, plus im pretty sure you could get the 2.5 with auto in some non se-r sentras. I like the 02-05 corollas reasonably well, but they have no torque whatsoever. My memory on the 95-01 is too vague to pass judgment. I really like the vibe/matrix idea. ALSO torqueless but still decent vehicles that will be highly functional and not tempt you to modify them. 3.0/auto camrys are just fine to drive imo.

  3.0 Camry = bad mileage though :( I'd definitely opt for the 2.2.
  

  Regarding the Sentra: I'd rather the 1.8 as it gets better mileage than either of the other two. It's also cheaper.

  Torqueless doesn't bother me that much. Most of these cars are pretty slow.

  The vibe/matrix is out of my price range. Nothing locally under $5K.

  Currently a newer auto Saturn or a Corolla top the list. The former I know a ton about and can be had for half the price. Its also easier to find an example that's not going to depreciate at all (like the last 2 I've owned) The latter is likely the less needy/troublesome option but requires some more $ up front. I may bide my time and wait for a good Corolla to show up on craigslist and jump on it.

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  Oct. 2, 2011 10:56 p.m. Vigo Dork

  Well to be fair a 3.0 camry can do 25mpg combined if you drive it right.

  Also, i wouldnt care that much about the sentra cat chunking thing. It might take a little more work up front to find one that has no damage, but if you want a small car that doesnt have a depressing lack of torque, it would be worth it.

  As far as the corollas.. I cant say they are terrible, i drove 2 02-05 automatics just in the past week and didnt HATE them. BUT, food for thought.. id WAY rather have another mazda3 for that money, and they are starting to go in the 4-5k range. I sold our old 04 with 130k on it for $4350 early last year. a little faster, a lot better looking, similar reliability, and in spite of the bigger engine, same or slightly better mpg.
  

  Problem being you might be tempted to mod it.

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  Oct. 3, 2011 7:42 a.m. tuna55 SuperDork

  I have to say it. This doesn't come up often, but my PT Cruiser is an amazing appliance. Nothing EVER breaks. Tires are cheap, insurance is cheap, I get 28 highway (not sure city, maybe 24?), the sunroof rocks and the leather/suede seats are super comfy, especially if you like a relaxed upright driving style. It's got a nice interior and a very flexibly hatch. Parts are very cheap and it NEVER EVER BREAKS. I did brake pads in 10 minutes, not per side. The only uncommon wear items are the control arm bushings (afternoon) and timing belt (day). Motor mounts can go to, best to check then when you take them out for the timing belt. I changed mine at 120K, take that Honda guys. Ours has 132k on it and still feels solid.

  Not that pretty, certainly not the sexy or fun, but it's a fab appliance.

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