Forums » Grassroots Motorsports » So am i alone? 1 2

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  July 22, 2011 10:19 p.m. JtspellS Reader

  I will avoid at all cost buying a vehicle with a timing belt, am i the only one?

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  July 22, 2011 10:22 p.m. JThw8 SuperDork

  I wouldn't pass on a car with a belt. There's lots of things to consider. There are plenty of fun cars out there with a belt so I can cross them off. Next I consider if they are interference or non-interference motors, that weighs in. Finally I consider if there's documented proof of timing belt maintenance and how difficult a DIY belt change is.

  Bottom line is you are missing out on a bunch of potentially great cars if you rule out anything with a timing belt.

  OTTER: "I think that this situation absolutely requires a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody's part." BLUTO: "We're just the guys to do it."

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  July 22, 2011 10:23 p.m. MrJoshua SuperDork

  No-but I would guess you aren't in the majority.

  Just one zuccinni as i get there property Vibram all 5 ring finger shoes and boots anticipating everyone uncover.

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  July 22, 2011 10:25 p.m. aussiesmg SuperDork

  Nope, my GTV6 has one, and needs a new one every 50K.

  One out of 24 cars though...

  Cornering is like bringing a woman to climax. Jackie Stewart

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  July 22, 2011 10:42 p.m. triumph5 SuperDork

  yup

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  July 22, 2011 10:52 p.m. Lugnut Dork

  I never keep a car long enough to worry about changing a timing belt anyway.

  A mouse has cut the wire! Good-by!

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  July 22, 2011 11:00 p.m. 93gsxturbo HalfDork

  I drove DSMs, cars known for timing belt failure from lack of proper maintenance, for 10 years daily.

  Never had a timing belt related issue. I would say your fears are unfounded. You are missing out on a lot of great motors with such narrowmindedness.
  

  If timing belts are bad, you better call Jesel and Comp and tell them.

  http://www.jesel.com/innovation/

  http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store...

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  July 22, 2011 11:02 p.m. Run_Away Reader

  I'm a fan of belts, hate chains. That just might be because I drive old Hondas and work on new Nissans for a living. Massive timing covers all stuck together with silicone that takes forever to clean properly, it's all a big mess. Belts are dry and fairly clean, there's no mucking around with silicone and you don't need to be jacking up and down the motor to magic the timing covers out.

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  July 22, 2011 11:25 p.m. bigdaddylee82 New Reader

  I've got a FWD Volvo. I get the best of both timing belt and interference engine. I stick to a ~70K mile/7 year change interval (I think the book says 100K/7 years), and do all associate tensioner, idlers, and water pump (driven off of the belt). I've grown to love my Volvo, it's got eleventy billion miles on it, and I do all of the maintenance, with quality parts, so I know there's nothing to worry about.

  There are some pretty well documented cases of catastrophic head/valve trauma when a timing belt goes on a White Block Volvo, but there are many more 250K+ mile properly maintained examples.

  If I'm buying a new interference/timing belt car, I want documentation of the last change, or simply figure the cost of all associated parts as part of the purchase price.

  If you're still worried, you can spring for a $$ Kevlar timing belt on a lot of different applications now.

  • Lee
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  July 23, 2011 2:47 a.m. ncjay Reader

  Timing belts are no more or less evil than a chain. Things can go wrong with either one, and from my experience, a timing belt is usually easier to change.

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  July 23, 2011 5:05 a.m. egnorant Dork

  ALL costs???

  You have simply picked you side in the debate and have your points that are important to you.

  I may subconsciously deduct a point or two if it were an interference engine.

  What about belt driven accessories!! $500 Miata with new tires and a hardtop...OMG run away!

  I think you are in the smaller group here!

  Now if you were talking particle board.....

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  July 23, 2011 5:12 a.m. dean1484 SuperDork

  And then there is the 944. People make the timing belt change out to be the second coming of armageddon in these cars. The reality is that you can get it done in less than an hour.

  Timing belts are not a problem. The interference engine is where my hatred starts. I am saving a very special place in hell for the engineer that thought that was a good idea.
  

  When I was racing 944's I actually considered having a set of pistons made that had bigger valve reliefs in them to fix the interference problem. Combine this with shaving the head to bring compression back up and all would be good. Unforchantly the cost per piston made this a bit prohibitive at the time (15 years back).

  Respectfully, Dean

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  July 23, 2011 5:50 a.m. integraguy SuperDork

  I've had several cars with belts, and never had one break one me. Thank heavens, I TRY to practice preventative maintenance. That said, I try to avoid buying cars that do have belts (at my budget point, next to impossible) or try to find out if I will be dealing with a interference or NON-interference engine design.

  I suppose that in about 20 more years it will be difficult to find even used cars with belts, but in the meantime, ruling a car out for having one (or two?) is going to limit you to not owning some pretty sweet cars.

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  July 23, 2011 7:08 a.m. petegossett SuperDork

  The VW VR6 has a timing chain which requires regular scheduled replacement of it and the guides/tensioners. I recall mine was due by 80k.

  The bad thing is VW engineers decided it was a good idea to put the timing chain on the clutch-side of the engine. Yeah, that's right, you either pull the engine or drop the trans for that job.

  I'll take timing belts, unless we're talking old-school pushrod V8s.

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  July 23, 2011 7:13 a.m. Jay_W Dork

  I haven't had a problem with a timing belt yet...not even on turbo rallycars. Gates makes a "racing" version that's all fancy and Kevlar and stuff even.

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  July 23, 2011 7:52 a.m. Taiden HalfDork

  Not buying cars with timing belts? Isn't that akin to only dating virgins for fear of getting AIDs?

  Plus, consider that if a timing chain snaps, it practically grenades everything under the timing cover. When a timing belt snaps, if it's an interference motor, you might need what... another head at most? Perhaps a single piston with rings? If it's not an interference motor, it's just as bad as calling the tow guy because your throwout bearing decided to grenade. Are you going to stop buying 5 speeds because they have throwout bearings?

  Personally I think subaru got it right with the eg33. The intake and exhaust valves are interference, but the valves and pistons are not. The intake and exhaust cams are gear driven, while each set of cams are on a belt. So you have interference valves that cannot possibly skip a tooth unless you manage to complete shave all the teeth off your cam gears. All the time having a non-interference engine with a timing belt. At least, that is what the internet tells me.

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  July 23, 2011 9:23 a.m. iceracer SuperDork

  That last paragraph really confuses me. Then I see I am not the only one

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  July 23, 2011 10:16 a.m. Taiden HalfDork

  Are you referring to mine?

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  July 23, 2011 10:28 a.m. Duke SuperDork

  I've never hesitated to buy a car with a timing belt.

  Even if the chain itself doesn't wear out, don't forget there are tensioners etc. that can still go wrong. And don't forget the infamous GM nylon-coated timing gear issue. How many cars fell victim to that one? Mine did.

  Junior Brown is my hero.

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  July 23, 2011 10:42 a.m. nicksta43 Reader

  Thinking back on the 20 or so cars I've owned over the years 0 have had a belt.

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  July 23, 2011 2:12 p.m. mad_machine SuperDork

  I actually prefer cars with belts. Less rotational weight.. and one of my cars is a Fiat 124.. which requires the belt done every 20,000 miles.

  Be careful of your words, for someone will agree with them. Be careful of your conduct, for someone will imitate it. -Leih Tsu

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  July 23, 2011 4:32 p.m. Derick Freese Dork

  To be honest, it's not something I spend time thinking about. If I like a car and the motor is a decent motor, I couldn't care less if it had a timing belt instead of a chain. I've had both, and I've only ever had issues with the timing chain on my Nissan pickup with the KA24D motor. I've never had an issue with any of my Hondas, and I haven't had an issue with my 50,000 mile Astra yet, either. I know that I'll have to replace the belt in another 20,000 miles on the Astra, but it's not that difficult of a job, especially considering that it's a FWD car.

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  July 23, 2011 6:11 p.m. mad_machine SuperDork

  racinginc215 wrote: I'd rather do a timing belt then a chain. I can do my SHO timing belt in about 2 hours the timing chains of my 4.6 took 16

  Agreed.. I can do a fiat twin cam belt in about half an hour to 45 minutes

  Be careful of your words, for someone will agree with them. Be careful of your conduct, for someone will imitate it. -Leih Tsu

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  July 23, 2011 8:48 p.m. JtspellS Reader

  It is not the issue of the engines themselves, it just feels like someone said lets just be cheap here.

  Just one of the things in the back of my mind that bothers the hell out of me dunno really why it does

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  July 23, 2011 8:51 p.m. wlkelley3 Dork

  You mean they still make engines with timing chains?

  I keed!

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